16 Comments

1. Jimmy Legs February 23rd, 2009 at 2:22 pm

   wait, are these the cheap apartments the old-timers keep telling us about? what is that, like 100 sq ft per person? this is so depressing.

2. Jeremy Sapienza February 23rd, 2009 at 4:29 pm

   What are you talking about?

3. Jimmy Legs February 23rd, 2009 at 10:22 pm

   just how no matter what kind of deal you post for apartments, somebody always comes along and says, ‘whoa that’s so expensive, you’re getting ripped off,’ etc. if the $600 apartments are 20X10 room-halfs, i’ll pass.

4. Jeremy Sapienza February 23rd, 2009 at 11:17 pm

   Oh, right. Those usually aren’t “old-timers,” that’s what confused me. Another thing to note is that Mexican immigrants have been “over”paying for tiny, crappy spaces in Bushwick since long before most hipsters and artists got here.

5. mopar February 24th, 2009 at 9:20 pm

   I’m so glad the NYT is covering this. I’ve been looking for a place and seen a lot of these. It’s usually 8 to 12 people sharing a five-room apartment. They rent by the room and two or three will share one room.

   Maybe in some cases, the total rent roll exceeds what the apartment would rent for as a whole, but I don’t know that for a fact. I think the appeal of the SRO situation is the individuals don’t have to come up with a deposit. And the rent per person is low, of course.

   The other pattern I’ve seen is one family plus a third adult, usually a sister, often with children of her own, will rent a place together. (Presumably a better arrangement.) This can be pretty convenient for child care too.

   Sometimes I do find out how much the total rent roll for a place is, and it’s almost always $1200 or $1300 per five-room apartment. But in all these cases the renters had been there for years.

   I would like to point out that it is possible to rent a two-bedroom for $1200 below Myrtle or on the JMZ. You do have to come up with a deposit, though.

   There could be a language issue too. In all these places I have seen, the landlords and the tenants spoke only Spanish. So far as I know, the places are advertised by room on flyers in Spanish. (Not Craigslist.)

   It’s a dangerous and depressing situation. On the positive side, such as there is, the people I have met in these situations have been kind and courteous with each other. I admire their cooperation and ingenuity.

   I wish something like the two-sisters-sharing-childcare-and-house had been possible or thinkable in my social group when I was younger. I’d have saved a lot more money earlier and have a kid to boot.

6. Steve February 25th, 2009 at 10:20 am

   How depressing that we are back to the unsafe, overcrowded conditions of a hundred years ago. I guess there is a cost to letting gazillionaires hog all the space in Manhattan. And a cost to creating a working class that lacks even the minimal worker rights of citizens in the US. The city should seize unfinished luxury condo developments and turn them into affordable housing (putting construction workers back to work). Restrict the amount of space that can be used for a single set of occupants, thus expanding the units in Manhattan. The Federal Government should legalize everyone working in this country, strengthening their bargaining position and improving their purchasing power (helping to revive the economy by expanding demand without additional debt). Tenement conditions largely disappeared for a time in New York City as a result of improved conditions for workers and expansion of non-profit forms of housing (union co-operatives, public housing, etc). It can happen again.

7. Professional Alternative February 25th, 2009 at 11:19 am

   Oh god, get real. Nobody listens to head-in-the-clouds populism — just ask the NYU brats. Seizing property and defenestrating the rich never did anything good for any economy. Nobody NEEDS to live in New York. If you WANT to, you have to pay.

   Tenement conditions never disappeared, I can’t even imagine where that idea might come from. Bushwick has been one big crumbling tenement for 40 years. Public housing is practically synonymous with blight and crime and a complete cultural and societal breakdown. More of the same will not improve life for anyone.

   Fortunately, this new wave of immigrants is using these inexpensive spaces as either a spring pad toward a new life here or as a temporary way station where they can make money and then go home. A legalization of their status would be great for their bargaining power, of course, and should be encouraged.

8. Dresden February 25th, 2009 at 11:33 am

   “A legalization of their status would be great for their bargaining power, of course, and should be encouraged.”

   Why should we encourage this? They don’t have rights. They aren’t citizens. Why would we want to help their bargaining power? They are ILLEGAL.

9. Professional Alternative February 25th, 2009 at 12:04 pm

   Your argument is that they are illegal therefore they should not have a chance to be legal. That’s circular.

   Even the wackiest conservative wouldn’t say illegals have NO rights.

10. Dresden February 25th, 2009 at 12:29 pm

    I admire illegal immigrants. A lot. They are strong, resilient, and in the sense of LIFE, I believe they are closer to the “Zeitgeist” than spic and span middle America.

    That being said, I wonder what sort of rights I would get if I illegally emigrated to any of their nations?

    Should we give them health care? We don’t give OURSELVES health care!!!

11. Dresden February 25th, 2009 at 2:05 pm

    San Francisco gave illegal immigrants sanctuary until the unconsciable law allowed the unconsciable to happen – an illegal immigrant who would have been deported ended up killing a father and two sons in a road rage incident.

    http://www.numbersusa.com/content/news/july-22-2008/widow-blames-san-francisco-sanctuary-pol.html

    Adding insult to injury, this illegal immigrant will most likely not face the death penalty due to the SF DA’s pledge to never pursue it.

    Even the wackiest liberal wouldn’t say illegals have the right to dodge deportation 100% of the time.

12. Professional Alternative February 25th, 2009 at 4:14 pm

    You seem to be defining “rights” rather broadly. I’m not talking about the right to health care or the right to really good ice cream, but basic human rights, like that of being left alone if one is minding his own business, as most people, including immigrants legal and illegal, do.

    Your little anecdote has little to do with the root of the issue we’re discussing and is a purposeful and pretty weak diversion.

13. mopar February 25th, 2009 at 4:18 pm

    Granite kitchens for everyone!

14. Dresden February 25th, 2009 at 5:17 pm

    Have you looked around? Basic human rights? I’m not sure I’ve ever seen any.

15. ricmac01 February 25th, 2009 at 5:37 pm

    And, in Bushwick, stainless steel appliances!!

    So, illegal immigrants, the moral of the story is that if you’re going to road-rage do it in the Road Rage Capital – Miami. Oh, yeah – what were we talking about?

16. Dresden February 26th, 2009 at 12:17 am

    We were discussing helping immigrants legalize illegal partitions in various apartments, making their residential situation less prone to DOB crackdowns. Like there are any… in a city with falling cranes.

    I do want to help the immigrants. I want to help them make their own nations worthwhile places to stay in. Fuck American Apparel – foreign sweatshops are good things. Those people are happy to have jobs. Dov is a self-absorbed wanker hiding behind social justice. Eventually there will be a global middle class, and it won’t be living in south central LA.